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October 23, 2006

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John

The chapter headings are exactly the same as those in Blood of the Isles, surprising as I had read there would be an additional chapter to make the material of more interest to a North American reader.

I found the liturgy of kings and nobles used as context uninspiring. Some of these men, Sykes claims, had an especially large number of descendants explaining some of the uniformity in DNA. On the other hand, I enjoyed two of the early chapters, about early surveys of physical characteristics; hair and eye colour, and blood type.

Genetic genealogy enthusiasts will find this book thin gruel. They may prefer to skip to the summary chapter 18 and the appendix. The basic data used is low resolution, less than the full range of the currently analyzed HVR1 for mitochondrial DNA, and mostly seven, sometimes ten, markers for Y-DNA. There is an appendix with summary tables, and a welcome web site with detailed data. I searched in vain for a listing of the marker profiles used to define groups.

These days, when much more detailed DNA analysis of mtDNA and Y-DNA is commonplace, this analysis seems rather broad brush, reflecting the state of the art in 2002 when the last samples appear to have been taken. It does show, in a non-technical presentation, that much insight can be gained from careful analysis of low resolution DNA data.

Dick Eastman

---> I had read there would be an additional chapter to make the material of more interest to a North American reader.

It is possible that such an addition might still happen. The copy that the publisher sent to me for review is clearly labeled, "Advance Reader's Edition" and "Advance Uncorrected Proofs. Please do not quote for publication without checking against the finished book."

It is possible that the final version that is to appear in bookstores within a few weeks may have differences from the advance copy that I read.

- Dick Eastman

Mike St. Clair

Note that this review calls it a "paperback" but Amazon calls it a hard back at their website. Thanks, Dick, for bringing this to our attention. In this day when DNA evidence is beginning to be very helpful to many genealogist, I'm one of many who will be enjoying this study. If it's halfway as readable and enjoyable as Sykes "Seven Daughters of Eve" it's going to be a fabulous read.

Mike

ckamp3

The criticism that genetic enthusiasts will find the book "thin gruel" is inappropriate.

If one could look into yhe future, there are many actions that would be changed. But the book represents a 10 year study using the methodology available. Should the study only be started now? I think not.

If the samples were saved, one can reanalize them with newer methods - which methods might well be antiquated in a few years.

The author is to be commended on providing important knowledge with appropriate documentation.

Charles Heisterkamp, III, M.D.

Paul Buttle

This is just a very poor book. There is much waffle just to pad the book out - although I own it is ably written. The nitty-gritty of Brian Sykes’ research is all explained in the last eight pages.

I’m just very surprised the eminent scientist/academic that Sykes clearly is should want to publish such a poor book.

Mic hael Lusk

I agree there is a lot of padding to this book. But some of the conclusions seem unsatisfactory as well. If the proportional genetic contribution of the post-Roman germanic invaders to the English population is as small as Sykes claims, how is it they dominated the language and culture of England so completely? Aside from place names, there is hardly a word of British Celtic origin in the English language. Likewise, the customs and mythology of the early English were completely teutonic. Hard to believe this could be pulled off by 10-15% of the population.

Also, if the recent studies are correct that a mutation allowing adults to fully digest milk products arose 5-6 thousand years ago in a single individual, and that 95% of Europeans have inherited this beneficial mutation, it means Europeans must have a single ancestor who lived at that time. But Syke's research apparently has missed this.

Seamus Maguire

Sykes effectively demolishes the legends of Arthur, as having been appropriated by "LongShanks", and the legends of the Scots and Welsh, but absolutely amazingly, accepts the Irish Mythology as being valid. He appears to accept that the "Fir Bolg" are a mythological race of "men of the bags" rather than "men of the Bolgi" (the peoples that Julius Caesar record as being in present-day England, and that Ptolemy records as being in Ireland). The guy has spent too much time in Dublin swallowing the horse-shit passing as history/archaeology in that unfair city and needs to have another look at his data. Even the infuriating use of "Oisin" as a name for a haplotype that came from Europe is laughable since, according to Irish Mythology, the "Fianna" were actually "Fir Bolg" - who according to Sykes, didn't exist.

Bryan Sykes is a well respected "Population geneticist", and his DATA will be valuable. Unfortunately, his interpretation of the data have been skewed by a nonsensical view of the history of the "Nesoi Pretannikoi" - the islands referred to by the Greeks as the Islands of the Pretanni

Richard Thrift

The haplotypes studied by Sykes were published at his website without further analysis or comment -most unhelpful. An analysis of his data was done by Kevin D. Campbell and published in the Journal of Genetic Genealogy Volume 3, Number 1, Spring, 2007 here:
www.jogg.info/31/index31.htm . The (re)analysis by Campbell does support Syke's basic conclusions.

Here is the intro to Campbell's summary:
"Through the analysis of Sykes’ OGAP data, this study has provided a means linking DNA results to haplotypes and conclusions in Sykes’ book, “Blood of the Isles.” The study has confirmed Sykes’ interpretation of the data, and hopefully, provided a means for other researchers to further validate and extend his work. The study both confirmed some subclades identified by Sykes as well as identified some new subclades worthy of further research. Key subclades that the study posits and which are defined by Sykes include those of the Picts and the Dal Riada Celts."


Note that Campbell also identified and (re)analysed the data for Stephen Oppenheimer’s book, The Origins of the British— A Genetic Detective Story here:
www.jogg.info/32/index32.htm
Conclusions:
"The analysis presented in this paper tends to confirm the hypothesis that Oppenheimer's Clan system is based upon the six microsatellites presented in the data of Cristian Capelli. Though only a small number of samples have been genotyped according to this system since the book has been published, these samples offer ample evidence to speculate on the haplotype signatures of specific Oppenheimer Clans. This paper has speculated on Haplotype matches for 16 of 21 Clans and Sub-Clans depicted in Figure 2. From the 15 for which we have both proposed haplotypes definitions and statements by Oppenheimer of the frequency of these Clans in his full dataset, we see that this analysis suggests that the sub-clans listed in Table 2 account for 84% of all the R1b data used by Oppenheimer."

Seamus the Celt

The book 'Blood of the Isles', whilst being an interesting read for 'The Man on the Clapham Omnibus', must be seen as bait for Prof Sykes's website. No data from the OGUP study is available there, but there are now lots of links to commercial organisations seeking to exploit the upsurge in interest in ancestry, and not one link to the data. How very disappointing. It seems somewhat of a scam.Do you know better?

J. REEDMAN

As someone who has had an interest in prehistoric British/Irish archaeology,tthe chance to study the dna was exciting. For many years I had always suspected there was no Anglo-saxon wipe out (not much skeletal/battlefield remains to prove it & certain parts of England also seem to have the darker 'aboriginal' phenotype plus the long mediterranean type head rather than the rounder alpine is far more predominant in England as a whole.Also, even if 200,000 saxons arrived, could they have wiped out (with little or no trace)3 million?
secondly i suspected there was no huge immigration of celts to the either Britain or Ireland in the 5th c BC, 'wiping out' the natives.The descriptions of continental celts given by the Romans don't generally match the appearance of modern 'celts' (esp the very dark ones in the west of Ireland and in Wales) so I'd have to go with the idea of limited input and a strong aboriginal base that had probably been using some form of celtic language since at least the bronze age.
Interestingly, long before dna testing, at the beginning of the 2oth c anthropologists DID indeed believe the first people of the Isles were from Iberia. Although megalithism developed in various places, you can see a strong link down the western seaboard, from the very old dolmens of Spain, through to brittany (which spread its tomb types to ireland) and possibly even influenced Stonehenge which has some very breton features (horseshoe,rectangle and possibly a carving too.)
Back to saxons--it is quite possible for a ruling minority to impose culture/language on a population. The Normans did a pretty good job of it-within a few decades young English kids were given first names popular amongst their overlords & the Saxon monickers like Etherlwulf died out, French words were adopted into English etc

Robin Wilson

This is a wonder-full read for those of us who are not geneticists and yet find the subject interesting. Bryan Sykes has written about genetics in a fun and interesting way and had me laughing more than once. If you are a geneticist looking for a more in depth study my opinion is that there's plenty of raw data out there to keep you busy-this book,thankfully, is for those of us who don't want to slog through it.

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